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	<title>Comments on: Defending Rights</title>
	<link>http://enableate.com/steve/2008/1204</link>
	<description>make it happen</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 21 Nov 2008 00:21:40 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: steve</title>
		<link>http://enableate.com/steve/2008/1204#comment-15103</link>
		<author>steve</author>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jul 2008 15:52:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://enableate.com/steve/2008/1204#comment-15103</guid>
		<description>Its hard for me to give Liberal the banner on defending individual rights when there only claim to fame is civil rights in the sixties. One could easily argue that conservatives have consistently defended individual rights on gun ownership. In other words its a wash, both groups have defended an individual right. 

In regards to abortion I realize arguing right to privacy is not an enumerated right was weak. Thats why I buttressed this position with a second argument about how the conservatives on this topic are fighting for the child's right to life. Oddly, if i had to give priority to rights, I would probably land on the right to life over the right to privacy, but really having neither does not sound very appealing. However, the fact that one group is fighting for the individual right to life while the other group is fighting for the individual right to privacy means neither group comes out ahead in defending individual rights count.

In your revision i still see the conservatives coming out more in favor of individual rights because they defend economic rights. However if we were to split the two political groups into sub groups each I think we can probably agree. The more religious right side of conservatism is much more into violating individual rights then the more economic\libertarian side. 

It might be true that democrats can be separated into two groups. The liberal group has an abysmal track record defending economic rights but a solid record defending civil rights. I'm not sure what the other sub group of democrats looks like. Traditionally they used to support strong state rights. They were also the ones that supported separate but equal laws.

Ultimately, the economic conservative\libertarian has done the best job of  defending individual rights. I think a strong argument can be made that liberals come in second over the religious conservatives, but the problem here is that religious groups fought just as hard for civil rights in the sixties. In matters of abortion both groups fight for different individual rights. But what puts liberal ahead is their valiant effort to defend the rights of homosexuals.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Its hard for me to give Liberal the banner on defending individual rights when there only claim to fame is civil rights in the sixties. One could easily argue that conservatives have consistently defended individual rights on gun ownership. In other words its a wash, both groups have defended an individual right. </p>
<p>In regards to abortion I realize arguing right to privacy is not an enumerated right was weak. Thats why I buttressed this position with a second argument about how the conservatives on this topic are fighting for the child&#8217;s right to life. Oddly, if i had to give priority to rights, I would probably land on the right to life over the right to privacy, but really having neither does not sound very appealing. However, the fact that one group is fighting for the individual right to life while the other group is fighting for the individual right to privacy means neither group comes out ahead in defending individual rights count.</p>
<p>In your revision i still see the conservatives coming out more in favor of individual rights because they defend economic rights. However if we were to split the two political groups into sub groups each I think we can probably agree. The more religious right side of conservatism is much more into violating individual rights then the more economic\libertarian side. </p>
<p>It might be true that democrats can be separated into two groups. The liberal group has an abysmal track record defending economic rights but a solid record defending civil rights. I&#8217;m not sure what the other sub group of democrats looks like. Traditionally they used to support strong state rights. They were also the ones that supported separate but equal laws.</p>
<p>Ultimately, the economic conservative\libertarian has done the best job of  defending individual rights. I think a strong argument can be made that liberals come in second over the religious conservatives, but the problem here is that religious groups fought just as hard for civil rights in the sixties. In matters of abortion both groups fight for different individual rights. But what puts liberal ahead is their valiant effort to defend the rights of homosexuals.</p>
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		<title>By: boose</title>
		<link>http://enableate.com/steve/2008/1204#comment-15099</link>
		<author>boose</author>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jul 2008 04:36:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://enableate.com/steve/2008/1204#comment-15099</guid>
		<description>I would merely say that your concession on civil rights proves my point pretty nicely.  Also, claiming that property rights are the most important is pretty silly.  An army that act like the British army did before the revolution makes any property rights that you might have had relatively useless.  Also, you're clinging to the constitution a little bit too much.  Just because a right isn't explicitly specified in the constitution, it isn't any less of a right.  The right to an abortion is just as much about your property right to your own body as gun ownership.  The right to a gay marriage and many civil rights are just as much about the government butting out of people's lives as zoning laws.  

Lastly, the argument that most conservatives are fully interested in the government leaving people alone is misguided.  Many conservatives are happy to hear that the government is funding their pet religious project, and it isn't as though the Bush republicans didn't do a damn good job of expanding government power.  What you really mean when you talk about "conservatives" is "libertarians".  The only thing is that conservatives are more in line with the policies you're interested in because the political spectrum has been moving in the liberal direction for a while now.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would merely say that your concession on civil rights proves my point pretty nicely.  Also, claiming that property rights are the most important is pretty silly.  An army that act like the British army did before the revolution makes any property rights that you might have had relatively useless.  Also, you&#8217;re clinging to the constitution a little bit too much.  Just because a right isn&#8217;t explicitly specified in the constitution, it isn&#8217;t any less of a right.  The right to an abortion is just as much about your property right to your own body as gun ownership.  The right to a gay marriage and many civil rights are just as much about the government butting out of people&#8217;s lives as zoning laws.  </p>
<p>Lastly, the argument that most conservatives are fully interested in the government leaving people alone is misguided.  Many conservatives are happy to hear that the government is funding their pet religious project, and it isn&#8217;t as though the Bush republicans didn&#8217;t do a damn good job of expanding government power.  What you really mean when you talk about &#8220;conservatives&#8221; is &#8220;libertarians&#8221;.  The only thing is that conservatives are more in line with the policies you&#8217;re interested in because the political spectrum has been moving in the liberal direction for a while now.</p>
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		<title>By: Jamie</title>
		<link>http://enableate.com/steve/2008/1204#comment-15098</link>
		<author>Jamie</author>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jul 2008 02:23:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://enableate.com/steve/2008/1204#comment-15098</guid>
		<description>Your reliance on calling out gun control in your arguments is silly.  In national elections, be it for president, congressmen, or judicial appointees have not factored this element into a real issue is some time.  While I agree it might be timely given the recent vote in the courts regarding washington, I don't see it as a hot issue anymore.  Heck look at the national election taking shape.  Have you heard either McCain or Obama mention guns (with the exception of Obama's snarky comment)?   The 2nd ammendment defenders have mobilized well and have basically won.  Gun ownership is going to continue to be legal through appropriate channels and easy for the average american to achieve.  

Abortion will also remain legal through appropriate channels as it serves it's purpose for our country.  While you might hear it come up every now and again in the news, it is a far cry from the real issues facing the average american voter.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your reliance on calling out gun control in your arguments is silly.  In national elections, be it for president, congressmen, or judicial appointees have not factored this element into a real issue is some time.  While I agree it might be timely given the recent vote in the courts regarding washington, I don&#8217;t see it as a hot issue anymore.  Heck look at the national election taking shape.  Have you heard either McCain or Obama mention guns (with the exception of Obama&#8217;s snarky comment)?   The 2nd ammendment defenders have mobilized well and have basically won.  Gun ownership is going to continue to be legal through appropriate channels and easy for the average american to achieve.  </p>
<p>Abortion will also remain legal through appropriate channels as it serves it&#8217;s purpose for our country.  While you might hear it come up every now and again in the news, it is a far cry from the real issues facing the average american voter.</p>
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		<title>By: Michael</title>
		<link>http://enableate.com/steve/2008/1204#comment-15096</link>
		<author>Michael</author>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Jul 2008 20:51:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://enableate.com/steve/2008/1204#comment-15096</guid>
		<description>Ultimately both parties trample rights whenever they think it will get them some votes or some campaign contributions.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ultimately both parties trample rights whenever they think it will get them some votes or some campaign contributions.</p>
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